I’m curious on a couple of points:

1) What is your definition of “less-than-ideal” ROI? Advertisers wouldn’t still be investing in this media if it wasn’t yielding them the results they expect. But are we talking apples or oranges here?

2) And the poor cost per lead you are claiming, compared to what??

3) Also not sure what you mean by “YP internal tracking”. Most publisher use dedicated RCF lines where the reports are provided by a third party telecom group.

Yours claims are are not new ones. But the track record of supposed monitoring companies like yours and their efforts to discredit the results that the Yellow Page industry consistently brings year after year after year for the advertisers, while also “free” are equally biased (duh), especially when you peel back the onion a little see how and what they are supposedly measuring…..

My company tracks yellow page advertising for about 200 different small to medium sized businesses in markets across the country. In all but the most rural markets, the return on investment is less-than-ideal to horrible. The volume of leads is dropping and the cost per lead is sky rocketing.

If you own a small business and you’re still using the print YP books or the online variations, make sure you are tracking your results – either on your own or with a company like ours. Don’t use the YP internal tracking methods – those might be “free” but they are heavily biased (duh).

Ben

Ok, for the 100th time, that 60% “fresh cut” material is saw dust and other mill byproducts, as in residual that has already occurred from milling activities. I assume whatever abode/hole you live in has a wood frame. Round logs milled into rectangular lumber does result in a fair amount of residual, which in years past was hauled right off to the landfill. Now its being recycled back into paper.

I was using Vista in a context I hoped you would understand. Yes, that was probably a wasted effort on my part wasn’t it. But you also didn’t deny what “your industry” is like did you????

The facts regarding prints’ use of fresh cut materials, according to the industry’s on PR, is 60%. Check for yourself: http://bit.ly/GEdbT

I could go on here but if you are interested in how much the directories, online, print, and moble helped during my relocation check out my blog.

I am currently not in the industry, in fact I’m unemployed, but I still believe in the product and in the company I used to work for. If a company has the right Sales rep and ad, both in size and content, then they will get calls. Since the ad can be measured easily, the only goal of the ad is to get calls (other ads create awareness and information), it is relatively easy to see the ROI of a directory program. Sometimes a lazy rep and a wrong ad provide less then stellar experiences for a company. Companies need to be a little more proactive and go to experts to design an ad that will work best.

Yes lots of businesses work without having a print ad… but that doesn’t mean directory ads don’t work, it just means that there are other methods, some more labour intensive then others to get clients. It also means that companies are not growing as fast or as big as they could. They have left themselves out of the decision making process of many consumers.

The recession has closed a lot of doors. It would be interesting to see who survived and what they did in order to survive. Many consumers are looking for new providers because they are either dissatisfied, in a different income bracket, or their provider shut their door. Many go to directories to help them decide who to contact. Some are good at searching on google but not everyone has the patience to wade through key word pollution to find the local provider. Afterall if you live in Vancouver BC you don’t want Vancouver Washington.

The phone directories provide consumers with a thorough list of providers and businesses available to them. It makes it easier then page upon page upon page of organic searches to find the one business that will meet your requirements. Online directories and Print Directories help start people off on their search for more information.

I’m sure if we used the same measure to gauge the success of Microsoft’s operating software systems or the amount of totally inaccurate crap that is posted through out the Internet, you would have to consider them even worse failures. Yet your very livelihood comes from this less than perfect tech world we now all have to live in.

I’m sorry that perfection doesn’t exist in the real world whether it be in software or a 1% failure rate for directory deliveries. Perhaps you just need to change your jogging path to get a fresh view.

The industry does seem to get hit from many angles due to nasty sales tactics, over delivery habits, and environmental concerns. While it’s true that there are many independent companies involved and solving problems like opt-out were not the original mission of the YP Association, organizations that fail to change will eventually die. The organization has clearly evolved to address new forms of revenue such as interactive. Maybe they can also adjust to new forms of customer service?

Arguing with Eddie has become more sport than anything else as his rants have become more obtuse and one sided than they use to be even in the face of the facts and industry efforts. I sense he’s a very frustrated man. I think I have better ways to spend my time as he’s been hogging the commentary here.

I disagree the YellowPagesOptOut.com site is “cheezy”. First you need to know that none of the trade association involved in the industry have any power to require their members do anything — it’s not how or why the associations were formed. I will tell you that I just came from one of the association conferences and its clear that publishers are aware that they will need to continue to provide and promote opt out information.

Secondly, remember these books come out annually so even if they make a change today, you may not see that change in your community for a year.

Third, it’s important to also know that each of these publishers run separate businesses. So even if you only want “one book”, which one should it be?? In my area there are 20 plumbers listed in the Yellow Pages do we really need 20?? There are nearly 100 attorney’s also list. Lord knows we don’t need 100, but who should decide which ones or how many we truly need? I could go on, but I’m sure you get my point — the marketplace will decide who and how many directories get published in each market. In our area two have recently ceased publishing — users didn’t use them so advertisers didn’t want to support them.